1. Joined
    28 Sep '06
    Moves
    0
    04 Oct '06 16:38
    Coincidence Statistics of the moves of GM Kramnik
    with recommendations of the chess program Fritz 9
    Elista, October 4, 2006

    After very detailed analyze of all games of the match we would like to present to your attention coincidence statistics of the moves of GM Kramnik with recommendations of chess program Fritz 9.

    First game:
    From 75 moves: After the 12th move of Topalov Ba6, a novelty, from 65 remaining moves – 41 moves match with the first line of Fritz 9. (63% of matches)

    Second game:
    From 63 moves: After 17th move, where the theory ends, from remaining 46 moves – 40 moves match with the first line of Fritz 9. (87% of matches)

    Third game
    From 38 moves: after 10th move, when the theory ends, from 46 remaining moves – 40 match with the first line of Fritz 9. (86% of matches)

    Forth game:
    From 54 moves: After 14th move, when the theory ends, from 40 remaining moves – 30 match with the first line of Fritz 9. (75% of matches)

    Sixth game:
    From 31 moves: After 13th move, when the theory ends, from 18 remaining moves – 14 match with the first line of Fritz9. (78% of matches)

    Thus, out of 5 games – 78% of GM Kramnik’s moves match with the first line of Fritz9.

    Sincerely
    Silvio Danailov




    http://forumforme.com/showthread.php?p=36#post36
  2. 127.0.0.1
    Joined
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    158564
    04 Oct '06 16:411 edit
    Yawn....

    you again??

    anyhoo, here are some questions so we can make those relevant.

    1. How were the statistics obtained? Was fritz just allowed to run until it match Kramniks move, or was it set to a certain ply/ time?
    2. What is Topalovs matchup?
    3. How many of the moves are forcing moves/openings/checks/captures etc.
    4. How many moves had a multiple "good" moves.
    5. Does Kramnik train with fritz?
    6. What was Topalovs match?
    7. What is the match of other Super GMs?

    Fritz is 78% as good as Kramnik, thats very impressive =)


    Edit: oh yeah, go take a stats class. If you had one, you wouldn't have bothered to copy this nonsense without conclusive proof.
  3. Joined
    21 Feb '06
    Moves
    6500
    04 Oct '06 16:48
    Originally posted by zebano
    Yawn....

    you again??

    anyhoo, here are some questions so we can make those relevant.

    1. How were the statistics obtained? Was fritz just allowed to run until it match Kramniks move, or was it set to a certain ply/ time?
    2. What is Topalovs matchup?
    3. How many of the moves are forcing moves/openings/checks/captures etc.
    4. How many moves had a mu ...[text shortened]... s. If you had one, you wouldn't have bothered to copy this nonsense without conclusive proof.
    I secound these points; but I'd also like to add:-

    80% is 2 in 10 moves.

    this must mean - that even if Krammik cheats using Fritz, he still has to use his brain 2 in 10 moves --- If he was a patzer, GM's would simply crush him.
  4. Edmonton, Alberta
    Joined
    25 Nov '04
    Moves
    2101
    04 Oct '06 16:51
    Even using a chess program half the time is a huge advantage. If you could use a chess program for a few of your moves in your own game wouldn't you have won some of those games you lost? You just have to know when to use them.

    They have human+computer vs human vs computer games. They have restriction of course about how long they can use it, how many moves etc... but they said Anand + a computer = 3200.

    So even using it 5 moves a game out of 40 moves is a huge huge advantage.

    I'm not saying he is or he isn't.
  5. Joined
    28 Sep '06
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    0
    04 Oct '06 16:52
    I would like more Kramnik's games to be analyzed for patterns.

    The suspicions are really high. There are way too many variations in a chess game, and to have 78% coincidance is a lot.

    I doubt Kramnik created Fritz 9 so he could claim the engine things like him.
  6. Joined
    21 Apr '06
    Moves
    4211
    04 Oct '06 17:08
    Originally posted by Los Angeles
    I would like more Kramnik's games to be analyzed for patterns.

    The suspicions are really high. There are way too many variations in a chess game, and to have 78% coincidance is a lot.

    I doubt Kramnik created Fritz 9 so he could claim the engine things like him.
    I swear you're stupid. I cant even be bothered to spend the time typing to crush this pointless prattle so I will just give you a link to Chess Ninja's which highlights the many flaws in Danailov's naff.

    http://www.chessninja.com/dailydirt/2006/10/danailov_accuses_kramnik_of_cheating.htm
  7. Joined
    21 Apr '06
    Moves
    4211
    04 Oct '06 17:111 edit
    To quote Jonathan Rowson

    First law of of probablity: Correlation does not prove causation.
    Second law of probability: Check prior probability before suggesting the correlation is meaningful.
    Third law of probability: If something is suggested by Danailov, it is probably false
  8. Standard memberWulebgr
    Angler
    River City
    Joined
    08 Dec '04
    Moves
    16907
    04 Oct '06 17:52
    Originally posted by Los Angeles
    Coincidence Statistics of the moves of GM Kramnik
    with recommendations of the chess program Fritz 9
    Elista, October 4, 2006

    After very detailed analyze of all games of the match we would like to present to your attention coincidence statistics of the moves of GM Kramnik with recommendations of chess program Fritz 9.

    First game:
    From 75 moves: A ...[text shortened]... z9.


    Sincerely
    Silvio Danailov




    http://forumforme.com/showthread.php?p=36#post36[/b]
    That's a novel idea: show a failure to understand in one thread, and then start another thread after others have pointed it out.

    RBHill?
  9. Hinesville, GA
    Joined
    17 Aug '05
    Moves
    7908
    04 Oct '06 19:442 edits
    Originally posted by Los Angeles
    Coincidence Statistics of the moves of GM Kramnik
    with recommendations of the chess program Fritz 9
    Elista, October 4, 2006

    After very detailed analyze of all games of the match we would like to present to your attention coincidence statistics of the moves of GM Kramnik with recommendations of chess program Fritz 9.

    First game:
    From 75 moves: A ...[text shortened]... z9.


    Sincerely
    Silvio Danailov




    http://forumforme.com/showthread.php?p=36#post36[/b]
    Hmmm! Yeah, Kram the Sham! Like I've always said! Topalov isn't too off! The Russian cheated! Oh, and I hope you all know that human moves mixed with computers moves versus an opponent is virtually invincible. Look what happened with Kasparov and Deep Blue? Don't tell me GM Joel Benjamin wasn't helping out Deep Blue to get a little Christmas Bonus from IBM.
  10. Seattle
    Joined
    30 Jan '06
    Moves
    26370
    04 Oct '06 19:48
    Originally posted by powershaker
    Hmmm! Yeah, Kram the Sham! Like I've always said! Topalov isn't too off! The Russian cheated! Oh, and I hope you all know that human moves mixed with computers moves versus an opponent is virtually invincible. Look what happened with Kasparov and Deep Blue? Don't tell me GM Joel Benjamin wasn't helping out Deep Blue to get a little Christmas Bonus from IBM.
    Joel was just the blunder check...deep did all the real thinking...plus its more intimidating to see a gm running the computer
  11. Standard memberXanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    p^2.sin(phi)
    Joined
    06 Sep '04
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    25076
    04 Oct '06 19:49
    Originally posted by powershaker
    Hmmm! Yeah, Kram the Sham! Like I've always said! Topalov isn't too off! The Russian cheated! Oh, and I hope you all know that human moves mixed with computers moves versus an opponent is virtually invincible. Look what happened with Kasparov and Deep Blue? Don't tell me GM Joel Benjamin wasn't helping out Deep Blue to get a little Christmas Bonus from IBM.
    Didn't we go over this before powershaker? There is no evidence that Deep Blue was helped by humans. You can look at the logs that it outputted during the match yourself if you wish. They are available online. But hey, why let some facts stand in the way of a good conspiracy theory?
  12. Domincan Republic
    Joined
    19 Apr '06
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    3886
    04 Oct '06 20:16
    Originally posted by XanthosNZ
    Didn't we go over this before powershaker? There is no evidence that Deep Blue was helped by humans. You can look at the logs that it outputted during the match yourself if you wish. They are available online. But hey, why let some facts stand in the way of a good conspiracy theory?
    XanthosNZ, My idea was that this thinking lines were not published, and that is why Kasparov was claiming the human help, or am I wrong?
  13. Hainesport, NJ, USA
    Joined
    22 Jun '04
    Moves
    17527
    04 Oct '06 20:25
    What is the "normal" correlation between Fritz and a top grandmaster percentage wise? Does anybody have an idea? There must be a way to scan the area to pick up any electronic devices, keep everything transparent. i don't think kramnik cheated. there are rumours in Russia that Topalov has gone to California to install a computer chip in his brain. it goes on and on.
  14. Standard memberWulebgr
    Angler
    River City
    Joined
    08 Dec '04
    Moves
    16907
    05 Oct '06 00:04
    Originally posted by buddy2
    What is the "normal" correlation between Fritz and a top grandmaster percentage wise?
    80-90%
  15. Standard memberleisurelysloth
    Man of Steel
    rushing to and fro
    Joined
    13 Aug '05
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    5930
    05 Oct '06 00:13
    Originally posted by Wulebgr
    80-90%
    Is that excluding the opening?
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